Consent of the governed who is the governed

If you want to save your local church property, you must endure the fight as a good soldier of Jesus Christ. Traditionalists must hold the ground won at GC, not surrender it in The impulse is a clarion call, now, or am I misreading? This is also about saving the vision and the future the direction. Managed separation is not my expertise, however , the forthcoming spreadsheets should have trusted endorsements of lay and clergy. Maybe some Christian business leaders that have unwound enterprises out there?

The obstacle to separation with fairness is the price tag. If one is trying to salvage ministry and has no other interest, the prospect is simple: just walk away and the people will follow. However, in most cases, there are other issues in play: material interests, legacies, powerful constituencies, and more. Separation is probably feasible in specific but limited circumstances. Progressive conferences will not be inclined to relinquish rights to properties or wealth where the conference perceives it has a clear advantage in negotiations.

Some cases are already in arbitration. The Methodist Church is in derision. There is not a strong Leader, a person or an assembly, that has come forth with a vision for either Conservative or Progressive Group to entreat enough cohesive people to follow them. Plans for each Group should be drawn up and submitted to the GC for separating as a divorce proceeding would for a married couple.

Each side cannot continue in our current relationship. A commitment document toward a vision for the future should be prepared; so that delegates would have clear and precise precepts of what is being addressed by their vote. The Easy Out Plan should be valid for both parties. Otherwise we perish in our own separate ways, individually and as an ununited Church.

The likely way ahead is simple. Progressives have no plans to leave the UMC. They are in the majority in the American church. Individual traditionalists will gradually find a new home, regardless of the official position of the Church expressed in the Discipline, even some churches may leave, depending on the legal hurdles, probably no Annual Conferences.

UMC will be left in control of progressives and soon all Bishops and church hierarchy will be progressive with no room left for Traditionalists. Thank you Jim and Gary for your responses. I understand nothing is too difficult for God, and in an ideal Christian world, the Bishops and clergy would uphold the oaths they took at ordination.

So we can all return to our mission of leading folks to Christ and back to a Christian way of living, I think the only win win scenario is to separate into different Wesleyan denominations. Shake the dust off our feet and move on. Just as you illustrate, Traditionalists are puzzled about what course is prudent now given the uproar in the wake of GC If one follows the comic but utterly serious narrative being discussed by Progressive agents such as Jeremy Smith, you realize that the Progressive sect is fixated on magical numbers and tantalized by the prospect of ridding the church of its traditional legacy.

Traditionalists remaining as placeholders are thorns in the flesh. Paul was not able to dispense with his, neither will victorious, hegemonic Progressives, when and if the time comes.

Leaving the UMC means laying down use of the brand, the logo, the appurtenances of office, the treasure in endowments and real estate, and more. Traditionalists may march out, but Progressives will insist they leave empty-handed. What does it profit to gain the whole world and lose your soul? If we truly have God in three persons on our side, are w really empty-handed?

The other stuff is just that … stuff. I love my sanctuary as much as the next person. God is bigger than that. Again, I sympathize with the sentiment to emigrate out of this mess. There is biblical justification for shucking off the past Luke , Isaiah However, some foresighted leaders perceive that a Traditionalist separation would end any cohesion that now exists. This prospect is sobering. Seven Mississippi congregations just left, The Evangelical Diaspora has thereby begun.

Meanwhile, Progressive UMC sites have several articles published per day. As for Traditional sites, save for a few comments posted herein, one hears mainly…crickets. Traditional Methodism is thus losing the social media battle. Generally whoever is able to frame the debate, wins. I am way too ignorant about this stuff, but not afraid to give my uninformed opinions, it seems. Gary Bebop, I do appreciate your interpretations. Get her to the table!!! He seems to enjoy complex financial distribution matricies.

Some denominational money should be spent now for consultants. Try to avoid lawsuits and stop the trickle of tired individuals and now churches. Traditionalist leaders have been quiet while Progressive worthies prattle away on social media. Agreed, I wish there was a more vociferous advocacy for the Traditionalists.

Progressive promotion in my liberal conference is incessant. Glenn Ball and Darrell Puls. Darrell Puls is a professional conflict interventionist with forty years experience in the corporate world and in church conflict resolution.

His many years of experience and observation on what destroys a church is invaluable. Overt and Covert forms of them. Their mission is to cause trouble, and to gain power! It has fianlly come to the point — and is very obvious now — that in the UMC, church leaders and the people have been VERY negligent in whom they allow to lead their churches [church denomination].

Then we all wonder why things are in such a mess now? This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. Learn how your comment data is processed. Comments OB says. July 1, at am. Charles Armour says. Terry says. July 1, at pm.

Ed C says. Jim says. Steve Salis says. July 2, at am. July 4, at am. We usually think of the Declaration in its historical context; and we tend to view it from the perspective of over two centuries of what must appear to be the inevitable existence of our government.

But Jefferson began the Declaration with an appeal to universal principles — when he wrote of the nature of governments, he meant all governments, including the one that declared its independent existence on the fourth day of July in Those words are often quoted. But it is the words that follow that make the Declaration truly radical. Jefferson was an idealist, and also an optimist — as most idealists are. He recognized the realities of political life, but even in the face of the most dismal realities, he maintained his faith in the inherent rights of the individual.

But can his majesty thus put down all law under his feet? Can he erect a power superior to that which erected himself? He has done it indeed by force; but let him remember that force cannot give right. Tuesday, October 19, Their even greater hope was that we the people would exercise our popular sovereignty to elect virtuous leaders who believe in freedom, and who uphold the Constitution.

While they believed that the only just government is one based on the consent of citizens to be governed, they also believed that citizens have to be worthy of such authority.

Government is formed with the consent of the people, and representatives are elected to govern. Ultimately, whose responsibility is it to ensure that the government changes its behavior if it becomes destructive?

What is the best comparison between a direct democracy and a republic? Email Address. Popular Sovereignty and the Consent of the Governed. The American colonists cried "No taxation without representation" when the British began taxing colonists for items like tea.

People consent to their government by voting for representatives. Video: Consent of the Governed. Test Your Knowledge Question 1 of 4 Government is formed with the consent of the people, and representatives are elected to govern.

Members of Congress. The President. The People. The representatives give power to the government through elections. The people give power to the government through their representatives.